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16 minutes ago, ink said:

im not sure if possible but what if its due to being able to unseal without grinding the lame or does that requirement still need to be full filled to unseal. So say a un-grinded value be min and grinded max on a lame d'argent?

Nope. Lame's grind on this server goes up to +35 which wouldn't fit the 50 ATP for the max roll ATP. You can unseal without grinding it. (Probably because the use option for Lame is hardcoded and Sega just didn't implement a grind a requirement.)

But you could always setup your own server using the same base client and remove the grind from Lame d'Argent to see that the resulting Excal gives you the same damage rolls over a sufficiently large set of data points.

You could also modify the stats of Excalibur in the ItemPMT to have max ATP set to 900, 1000, 1500, 5000, whatever you want, and verify the damage rolls have changed accordingly. Or you could nerf the Lame's stats to min and max ATP 1 to show that the weapon stats are independent of each other.

Edited by Ender
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3 hours ago, ink said:

im not sure if possible but what if its due to being able to unseal without grinding the lame or does that requirement still need to be full filled to unseal. So say a un-grinded value be min and grinded max on a lame d'argent?


No, it's just for damage variance like R-78 said. Excal's atp is 900-950, meaning it will choose a random number between 900 and 950 to use for damage calculations. Some weapons do not have any variance, like demolition comet and psycho raven, and will hit the exact same damage number every time, but the majority of weapons have an atp variable (but it's usually negligibly small, like <20).

Shifta bonus does affect atp variable and is added to the max, but the minimum is unchanged. So while a demolition comet may always add 530 atp +25gr, a meteor cudgel (300-560 atp, +15gr) will have its 260 atpVariable boosted to 384, resulting in 330-714atp with shifta30 when grinded (displayed as +714 only). However, while atpVar scaling sounds cool it's not actually great; since the average atp is still only 522, it's actually still weaker than demo comet (even if it can randomly hit much harder since the variance is so inconsistent). So really, all of this is moot anyway.

Vol Opt Gizonde and PB Golla / Farla / Pilla scaling do only care about displayed max atp though, so high atp weapons with high variables like Crimson Sword can be strong with buffs.

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8 hours ago, Dollypatton said:

What's so special about S rank weapons?

For a Humar Zalure lv21  slicer or handgun for range . 

  • Custom 8-character name (A-Z only)
  • Cannot have any attributes
  • Can have a custom special applied, which has no reduction regardless of weapon type.

 

Edited by ink
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On 12/20/2021 at 3:30 AM, ink said:

For a Humar Zalure lv21  slicer or handgun for range . 

  • Custom 8-character name (A-Z only)
  • Cannot have any attributes
  • Can have a custom special applied, which has no reduction regardless of weapon type.

 

By reduction you mean like mechgun or shot have the same chance as rifle or saber?

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51 minutes ago, Dollypatton said:

By reduction you mean like mechgun or shot have the same chance as rifle or saber?

As in their special attacks have more chance to hit i do believe

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I thought the only weapons that could have unreduced demons or hell were TYPE weapons?

Did you mean unreduced special on S-Rank, all weapons?

Edited by jespence
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1 hour ago, jespence said:

I thought the only weapons that could have unreduced demons or hell were TYPE weapons?

Did you mean unreduced special on S-Rank, all weapons?

That is correct sranks have unreduced special only a couple of srank do not take a special like drill launcher

mechs

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1 hour ago, jespence said:

I thought the only weapons that could have unreduced demons or hell were TYPE weapons?

Did you mean unreduced special on S-Rank, all weapons?

Not sure if we can link to other sources for information so ill just copy and paste the info here:

 

Quote

every weapon with hex value preceding Photon Claw can be reduced, if it comes with a special with reduced form (i.e. not sacrificial or elemental damage) and it attacks more than one time or capable of acquiring more than one target per attack (excluding cards). Specials of all other weapons are unreduced.


(So anything that is not in this list is unreduced)
Reduced special list:

 

Swords (reduced by 1/2) 
Sword
Gigush
Breaker
Claymore
Calibur
Last Survivor


Daggers (reduced by 1/2) 
Dagger
Knife
Blade
Edge
Ripper
Blade Dance
Bloody Art
Zero Divide


Partisans (reduced by 1/2) 
Partisan
Halbert
Glaive
Berdys
Gungnir
Gae Bolg
Asteron Belt


Slicers (reduced by 2/3) 
Slicer
Spinner
Cutter
Sawcer
Diska
Slicer of Assassin
Diska of Liberator


Mechguns (reduced by 2/3) 
Mechgun
Assault
Repeater
Gatling
Vulcan
H&S25 Justice
L&K14 Combat


Shots (reduced by 2/3) 
Shot
Spread
Cannon
Launcher
Arms
Crush Bullet
Meteor Smash
Final Impact

 


 

 

 

 

Edited by rashan0121
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4 hours ago, Dollypatton said:

By reduction you mean like mechgun or shot have the same chance as rifle or saber?

Many weapons (including all non rares) that can hit several monsters or several times in one attack (shots, mechguns...) suffer from specials reduction.

The definition of "reduction" is different for every special:

 

Hell type: less chance to hit

Chaos type: less chance for special to activate

Arrest type: less chance to hit

Gush type: lower HP% stealing

Geist type: lower TP% stealing

King's type: lower XP% stealing

Demon's type: lower HP% reduction

Burning type: unchanged

Tempest type: unchanged

Blizzard type: less chance to hit

Charge: unchanged

Berserk: unchanged

Spirit: unchanged

 

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16 hours ago, R-78 said:

Many weapons (including all non rares) that can hit several monsters or several times in one attack (shots, mechguns...) suffer from specials reduction.

The definition of "reduction" is different for every special:

 

Hell type: less chance to hit

Chaos type: less chance for special to activate

Arrest type: less chance to hit

Gush type: lower HP% stealing

Geist type: lower TP% stealing

King's type: lower XP% stealing

Demon's type: lower HP% reduction

Burning type: unchanged

Tempest type: unchanged

Blizzard type: less chance to hit

Charge: unchanged

Berserk: unchanged

Spirit: unchanged

 

Then the best added value s rank item would be a slicer/mechgun/shot with something like a Hell, Arrest, or Chaos? People recommend zalure but I want a hell shot and add hit to it. Thanks for feedback 🦾

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4 minutes ago, Dollypatton said:

I want a hell shot and add hit to it.

What you're looking for is called typeSH/SHOT, you can add 80 hit and the special you want, and ofc it is unreduced

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