Should Larva implement PSO2 style drops along with classic style?

[Misombre]

Nah Midori, I don't think Fyrewolf is talking about being fast or making money. Playing pso is not all about that is it ?

There is no "being superior to" or whatsoever, it's just that pso is a difficult game and has been made to favorise multiplayer.

Now, people are able to do most things by themselves and tend to learn how to solo everything... because they don't want to share, or I should say because they also want their share. So at the end, it looks like solo is favored. But the game was not designed this way.

I see you're talking about power material (normal difficulty), luck material (same), Glide Divine (need to scare poor sand rappies...). Of course everyone can do that alone and be more efficient. It's another story in ultimate though.

@Fyrewolf Multi-logging has always been around... on Ultima you mean ? If not only, I just was completely ignorant about it (well you can do it on GC/DC but it's a bother to manipulate several controllers) To me, it's not because there is a way to do something around a game that it means the game has been designed to do so. I don't think pso has been designed to have multi-log, just my two cents (but I have nothing against dual logging).

Edited April 28, 2016 by Misombre

[Midori]

I don't solo because I'm a selfish asshole. I solo because that's the best way to play the game. That's not my fault. I'm the one who is arguing for the game to actually favor multiplayer. You guys make it sound like I'm the bad guy because I want to play with others and not be punished for it. Just because the game was designed to allow up to 4 players to play together doesn't mean it favors multiplayer over solo.

If I want a Red Ring, and I can solo TTF in 15 mins, please explain to me a better method that involves multiplayer. Prove me wrong. I want multiplayer to be better than solo, so if you guys are right about soloing being inferior, please teach me the superior multiplayer methods. Thanks.

[Misombre]

No one is the "bad guy". Don't worry, people are just trying to figure a way out of this after all ideas have been considered.

I want to play with others and not be punished for it.

If I want a Red Ring, and I can solo TTF in 15 mins, please explain to me a better method that involves multiplayer. Prove me wrong. I want multiplayer to be better than solo, so if you guys are right about soloing being inferior, please teach me the superior multiplayer methods. Thanks.

I actually agree with that. I don't think there is even something to argue about that. Don't take it that way, we're here to share ideas and talk before everything else.

[dmoney1969]

Ultima server with all the events favors solo playing or passworded rooms. When a event is active there is nothing but people playing solo or in a group of friends helping them get the drop in a passworded room. 95% of the time if there's a open room it will be named "input name" PGF so that way the player who makes the room can hopefully get the drop and nobody will steal it. But it still happens and there is a post so and so stole my sta or pgf blah blah.Then GMS gotta sort it out. Gets tiring they busy enough. I have played psobb with pso2 style drops and its alot more fun period. I love this server and want better things for it to improve.

I would like to remind everyone that this is just a option when you create/join a game. You can still play normal drop mode all you want.

Edited April 28, 2016 by dmoney1969

[Fyrewolf5]

@FyreWolf5

You seriously think the game favors multiplayer over solo? I have 3000 power mats from soloing with 6 accounts over the past few days. I get 90 luck mats or 12 Glide Divines in a single HH from soloing with 6 accounts. If multiplayer is superior to this, please tell me how. I thought I was making money faster than any other player on the server but according to you, I am better off playing multiplayer and having the other players ninja the items instead. I don't understand.

Even if we ignore the multi client thing, solo still wins. I can solo TTF in about 15 minutes. If I play with others, we will clear in roughly the same time, but my chance at picking up the Red Ring is 1 in 4. How is multiplayer better again? Are you playing the same game as me?

You do understand that flooding the supply of mats does nothing but make the price of mats go down right? Meaning that you don't end up making more than anyone because your product is just depreciating. You also do realize that when you do a ttf with other players (which can be much much faster), they also will come to help you out on other hunts too and help you out when you need it most right?

How would make a pso2 drop system actually encourage people to play together, and not as I pointed out just solo with multiple clients for increased rewards? How would limiting to only 2 clients not actively DISCOURAGE people from playing with their friends and family, as well as punish people that actually prefer to solo?

There is nothing stopping you from playing with others Midori. Nothing at all. If you really want to play with others, then do it. There are always players looking for people to join their groups constantly. As for some of the other people choosing to play solo, that should not affect your ability to get enjoyment out of the game, and there is no reason to ruin their fun because you don't like that they chose to do so.

Some people prefer to play with others and work as a team to tackle tough quests/hunts. Some people don't (they are trying to time attack, want to challenge themselves, just plain antisocial and don't want to be around others, or whatever other reason). The current system favors playing with others for the ability to do harder, more rewarding quests, take care of each others weaknesses, and have each others backs when someone needs help with something else unrelated that they may not have the time or ability to get themselves. I've yet to see a suggestion made that actually does encourage playing with others, only ones that just massively fuck over some players, either punishing players that actually prefer to play solo (it doesn't matter why, it's still their choice to make) or making multiclienting for increased rewards incredibly overpowered. The bigger issue imo is with events, how long they last and how hard the drop rates are, more than the drop system itself.

Edited April 28, 2016 by Fyrewolf5

[NicholasW]

100% yes. It was actually something that was making me lean towards towards Ephinea (that and the new hud). It excites me incredibly to hear that this could be a possibility.

Currently if you are hunting something, you do it alone or with 'friends' there is 0 benefit to public hunting. Which sucks because that is when the game is the most fun. Also totally agree with Dmoney... why are we having admins deal with stolen items, why do we need etiquette? We should not be punishing people because of a technological inferiority in the game, why don't we just fix it?

... How does pso2 drop discourage people? Multiple clients was never intended, it is a workaround that we have adopted and used as base game... it isn't. I strongly prefer to play with others, but I am a ranger and am not running in to grab things all the time, so frequently, i'm left with nothing. I solo all the rest of the time to bother getting anything.

I feel this whole "multi-client" group is the vocal minority, we are trying to get more people on the server. Do we really think multi client users are the majority we are trying to attract? Really?...

How would make a pso2 drop system actually encourage people to play together, and not as I pointed out just solo with multiple clients for increased rewards? How would limiting to only 2 clients not actively DISCOURAGE people from playing with their friends and family, as well as punish people that actually prefer to solo?

Please stop being so dramatic. We have 70% of the people want it, less than 10% do not (so far)... how do you think those stats go into people who multi client? Why cater to multi client? Do you think people hear this server and go OH WOW MULTI CLIENT, WHAT IVE ALWAYS WANTED? I doubt it, very much.

I do not multi client, never plan to and the day I do I know I have gotten too into this game (no insult to those who do, good for you).

Edited April 28, 2016 by NicholasW

[dmoney1969]

100% yes. It was actually something that was making me lean towards towards Ephinea (that and the new hud). It excites me incredibly to hear that this could be a possibility.

Currently if you are hunting something, you do it alone or with 'friends' there is 0 benefit to public hunting. Which sucks because that is when the game is the most fun. Also totally agree with Dmoney... why are we having admins deal with stolen items, why do we need etiquette? We should not be punishing people because of a technological inferiority in the game, why don't we just fix it?

... How does pso2 drop discourage people? Multiple clients was never intended, it is a workaround that we have adopted and used as base game... it isn't. I strongly prefer to play with others, but I am a ranger and am not running in to grab things all the time, so frequently, i'm left with nothing. I solo all the rest of the time to bother getting anything.

I feel this whole "multi-client" group is the vocal minority, we are trying to get more people on the server. Do we really think multi client users are the majority we are trying to attract? Really?...

If i could give you a 100 up votes I would. I play as a ranger too and Hardly get any of the drops when playing multiplayer, Its nice to just hang back and Support your team knowing that any drop that is on the floor is yours. I was playing yesterday and this guy grabbed every single rare that dropped (he was a hucast) I left after that game and logged off.

[Midori]

Saith, you can have any opinion you want but what bothers me is how you straight up lie about the game favoring multiplayer. Knock it off. It's obvious to anyone who has experience with this game that it favors solo over multiplayer.

Look at your weak arguments. You actually argued that multiplayer is better than solo because if you solo, you get so many items that it floods the market and reduces the value of items. Wow. Solo is so good that it's bad? Really now?

And then after that, you argue in favor of multi client. But wait. I thought multi client lead to flooding the market with items and destroying their value. So which is it? You don't make any sense.

And why would limiting or disabling multi client punish people who solo? You can still solo. You should only need one client to solo, right? No one is saying we should remove the option to solo. We want the option to play multiplayer and still get items. If most players prefer multiplayer, doesn't it make sense to encourage multiplayer?

There is nothing stopping you from soloing either. If multiplayer becomes worth doing, you can still solo if you want. Even though players like you are in the minority, you will always have the option to solo. Maybe it won't be as efficient as multiplayer, but it makes sense to do what is best for most players. We want this server to grow and improve, don't we?

Again, you can prefer solo all you want and have the opinion that solo is awesome and it should be vastly superior to multiplayer. I disagree but that's fine. Just don't lie and expect to fool me into thinking that the game actually favors multiplayer. We both know that's not the case. You can argue that RoCT favors multiplayer but what about the other 99% of the game? And even if we are just talking about RoCT, wouldn't it favor multiplayer even more if we didn't have to fight over the items along the way?

[SelahIsASpot]

why dont we just bring back crack mode instead :v)

[NicholasW]

You do understand that flooding the supply of mats does nothing but make the price of mats go down right? Meaning that you don't end up making more than anyone because your product is just depreciating. You also do realize that when you do a ttf with other players (which can be much much faster), they also will come to help you out on other hunts too and help you out when you need it most right?

You do understand basic supply and demand right, well obviously you do. You do understand the gaping issues you've pointed out that currently exist right? I'm just confused... we let people multi-client which lets them farm tons of items, then you want them to artificially keep the price high because we aren't attracting enough new players? Why don't we solve both problems, attract more players by making the server more appealing... and fix the multi client issue (limit it so they cannot abuse it) which will stabilize the economy... correct me where I don't understand this...

Edited April 28, 2016 by NicholasW

[velociti]

Well I don't have much else to provide at this point. Psobb's current version supports single and multi in different instances.

Challenge mode requires players and teamwork (something that actually got me to talk to people other than trading and rarely group hunting/cca)

Endgame hunting for rares can be both good for solo and multi hunting, depends on your gear and who your community of friends is/how well geared they are. Me and you don't have cent/battles, so hopefully we can team up a few runs and get kills faster on mobs, or try other rare summer event mobs.

If your group of friends have DM's/DF's (from paying 300 dts or hunting a year ago), its more than likely they are greedy and don't want to hunt with players since they can solo it themselves and hoard 15 cent/battles over the event.

Now, for mid gear players (without DM's/DF's), 90% of the time hunting ep 4 and ep 2 with people is faster to get rares, for all mid geared players. MA4DMD dorphons are stupid solo'ing as a HU, but I can double or triple my kill speed & quest completion times in it if I team up with another class. Its a s simple as that. (Which is why I ask people to hunt MG+ with me or lame's, its faster for me and you also get 50% of the loot, we are both guaranteed 1 or 2 lame/MG+'s each in the hh)

Edited April 28, 2016 by velociti

[kajex]

Disabling multi-clienting is out of the question; it's also not a new feature, it's something that has always been around. No one is forcing you to play solo. If you actually believe the game favors solo over multi despite everything in the game design contradicting it, nothing will make you play with others, not even a different drop system. You could go play on ephinea right now with 4 accounts (can even put them all on the same email) and run around with all 4 of them hunting, reaping the rewards of 4x more rare drops and 2x more normal drops than you would get playing with other people multi. It's a little more work to run all characters into the next room, but the extra rewards for it are more than worth the hassle of having to be near the drop, if that's really all you care about.

I have to say, if someone's willing to deal with the giant pain in the ass of managing four clients to try and retrieve drops I would just call that dedication... Boring, lonely box hunting and a painstaking use of time. If someone really wants to be a literal box vacuum rather than playing with others I would not call that cheating. Powering on through quests with a team would seem just as productive.

The players at the advantage of the individual drops are the everyday players who can't make it through quests by themselves. You need top gear to do certain missions solo for hunting, and quite frankly that is boring. All the drop splitting will do is allow a more diversified group of people to earn rares. It would take some balancing, but could be a fun project for Soly when there aren't major events going on.

My one question for Soly would be is there a way to opt in? Kind of like *insert shitty lee server name here* used to allow you to choose between PSU and BB drops (random or to the player who finds them)? If not, how would this affect the drop rates for single-player missions?

[Soly]

The code I have (coded) already which affects only monster drops, is opt-in.

As I said a while ago, I have yet to make code for boxes but I don't want to waste time on it unless I know it will be used (after all I already got monsters lol)

1 Player, Battle and Challenge mode have it disabled by default. You won't even see the message of which mode you are using because there is no point

I have been doing various things here and there... but I guess is time to actually work on this.

The balancing, I won't do much, that's for sure... Probably just a single reduction based on the current amount of players in the room (which I haven't coded either) and haven't decided what will be affected. If rare drop, dar or both.

[Ardh2005]

The code I have (coded) already which affects only monster drops, is opt-in.

How do I opt in to this?

[Soly]

Is only GM accounts for the moment since I haven't had green light on it.